Talk:Genasi (3.5e Race)

Air Genasi LA

Is +1 LA to high for the air genasi? I can't decide.--ThirdEmperor 11:13, November 28, 2009 (UTC)

Well, to answer that question, I have to bring up some points that need to be resolved first. Take a look at the SRD:Air Subtype (yeah, that's right, air creatures get fly speeds). You'll need to resolve that. In addition, base land speed of 35 is not good, mechanically I mean. Take a look at SRD:Carrying Capacity#Armor and Encumbrance for Other Base Speeds (yeah, 35 feet falls in this weird awkward "not listed as a speed" speed for things like that). Boost it to 40 or back down to 30 and give them the Run feat or something else if you desire. Wind's Guardian makes no sense to me... is it like, some extra kind of special AC? A percent chance to knock away projectiles? Consider using the Deflect Arrows feat, with some modifications if need be to fit the flavor. I'll let you know about LA after all that is resolved, because right now its not playable. Also, if you want to consider other racial abilities, think about slow fall, jump bonuses, hold breath, and... that's all I can think of at the moment. Anyways, give it some thought. --Ganteka Future 06:12, November 29, 2009 (UTC)

Uh ya, its a chance to deflect any ranged attack with a gust of wind, wasn't that clear? Also I'm trying to keep this LA 0, it's kinda the whole point.

Hey what's with the incomplete template? I don't see anything missing.--ThirdEmperor 03:31, December 1, 2009 (UTC)

It was just that nobody had removed it. I just removed it. Surgo 13:54, December 1, 2009 (UTC)

By the way, what do you think of the race? I think it's the best thing I've put on the wiki yet, so I was interested in getting someone else's opinion. --ThirdEmperor 04:42, December 2, 2009 (UTC)

First Impressions

• Wind dependency is a nice flavorful drawback, but unfortunately it only affects warriors and such. Perhaps add that all DCs of the genasi's abilities are reduced by 1 if they rest in an area without wind, and any spellcasting genasi treat their spellcasting modifier as 1 lower for the purpose of bonus spells/day for that day? That way the penalty is "equal"-ish to all characters, rather than just penalizing attacker-types.
• Wind's Guardian - would this also affect rays and the like, or only missile attacks? Might want to clarify.
• 35' speed is a bit... weird for a medium character. Perhaps change the Air Genasi's speed to 40' (though that might push it to +1 LA) or reduce it to 30'? Another "cool" ability that's not too powerful that you can give them is to boost their speed by 10' as a swift action once per encounter. Not too powerful, very flavorful, and can help them get where they need when they need to, as well as help them get out of tough spots.
• Earth's Endurance is a bit strong IMO--basically, it's the equivalent of +4 con for the most important purpose for many characters (HP). Perhaps instead, give them scaling fortification? That is, at 6 HD they gain 25% immunity to crits and sneak attack, at 12 HD this upgrades to 50%, and at 18 HD they gain either 75% or complete immunity?
• Feet on the ground - again, penalizes attackers most of all. Perhaps -6 to the DCs of abilities as well?
• Fire genasi look fine, though the bonus is geared towards attacker--perhaps alternatively, add +2 to the DC of their next ability/spell when they use the ability? (I'd limit it to +2 since often spells are far more powerful than a single attack).
• Water's calm - since it goes away when you take enough damage, I think this is fine as-is, with no need to change, partially since it affects all rolls (for example, a caster might use it to boost their SR penetration roll).
• Water Dependency - see Wind Dependency and Feet on the Ground.

Hope this helps you out :-) --Ghostwheel 08:17, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

Doh! Forgot about the DC thingy, I'll fix that right away, good idea bout the fortification, but I've got moral objections about sneak attack negation (I almost always play rogues.), maybe if I reduced it to one hit point per HD? There was a feat that did something like that in complete warrior.--ThirdEmperor 08:25, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

That could work, though any decent rogue's gonna usually pick up Penetrating Strike, so they'll be doing at least 1/2 SA damage anyway. Furthermore, "monsters" don't usually use sneak attack, so it's not negating rogues--the rogue in your party will do just fine, since he's not fighting you. --Ghostwheel 08:27, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

I tried going for DR first because I want this to be something you can't get as a feat. What do ya think?--ThirdEmperor 09:01, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

DR's a no-go unless you want LA; however, how about a similar boost that grants DR for 2 rounds, usable once per encounter, and gives 1 DR per 3 HD, rounded up? That might work. --Ghostwheel 09:04, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

Dang that's a great idea, I kinda figured that DR would be overpowered as soon as I put it in.--ThirdEmperor 09:11, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

Okay added the DR boost thing and the air genasi speed boost, I also added a variant of Feet on the Ground for the desert-dwelling earth genasi. Thanks for the idea!--ThirdEmperor 09:24, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

n/p, Glad to be of help :-D --Ghostwheel 09:43, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

Other first impressions:

• Fluff bits are pretty solid.
• Air Genasi look pretty good.
• Earth Genasi look weak. They are slow, they are forced to remain on the ground (no underwater adventures, hosed if they fall off a cliff, can't ever fly, no mounts, etc.), and in exchange for these drawbacks they gain a 1/day mediocre DR without duration and the ability to count as an "earth" creature. The DR discussed above is better, but still not worth their other limitations IMO.
• Fire Genasi were ok until the Frost Vulnerability. I get that you're trying to give them all thematic elemental limitations, but it seems out of place compared to Wind Dependency or Feet on the Ground or Water Dependency which just make the genasi less effective instead of more dead.
• Water Genasi look ok.

I think Air is the best of the bunch. They get 2 special flavorful things to the 1 that the others get, their limitation works well, and they get to pick their favored class. I think the other 3 could use a minor boost, a reworking of their limitation, or both. - TarkisFlux 20:06, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

Ratings

Ganteka Future dislikes this article and rated it 1 of 4.

Despite the work that has gone into this so far, it still comes off as more of a rough draft than a final, reviewable version. Spelling and grammar errors abound. The racial flavor tends to pigeonhole personalities rather than offering suggestions for roleplaying or standard racial stereotypes. Relations with other races speak in such specifics, with no mention of why the race feels that way, that it is off-putting. Relations section should be about what particular traits of other races they agree with or disagree with. These are easy pitfalls to end up in when first designing races. Don't despair, you'll get the hang of it with practice and revision. The flavor should really be beefed up. It makes no mention of their own cities or independent culture, or if they simply try to leech off other societies when need be (water genasi does come close, as they don't need societies). All in all, this needs more work. Just a note: Earth's Endurance lacks a duration. So yeah, no favor here today. Despite saying not to rate this, it's been on the site since 2009, that makes it fair game. Really, this just isn't finished and should be shelved instead of published. Though, it isn't terrible, it isn't good enough to be passable either.

Incomplete?

Status says this is a "work in progress", but it's been that way since 2009. Is this incomplete, or what? Surgo 21:10, 29 July 2012 (UTC)